9-Ball
Topic: Comparison 9-Ball World Championships/Golf

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Here's the Setup,
Object Ball near the long Rail 2+ diamonds from the pocket or more & cue ball close by:

I recently wrote about force follow shots that come 3 around and back down table for shape. I mentioned those shots were not available in the World Championships (tight) due to either pocket size, shelf depth, pocket facings or a combination of them.

I also commented that I can't remember one player in all the matches I saw performing that shot, and I thought that was not right for the sport.

Here's my comparison and let me know what you think, if its a bashing smart allec reply about my post just keep it short.

In a PGA event I would like to tighten up all the fairways with trees and have them no wider that 30 yards. If this situation was present I think instead of using a Driver, we would see almost every player using their irons, why, because they would have more control and make sure they did not miss the fairway. They would not be using a club (driver/force follow) that they have learned to play with since the beginning, WHY, because of the conditions.

Whats happened because of the tight fairways, the game has drastically changed because they cannot use their full spectrum of shots, and I love to see John Daly boom one.

Pool is exactly the same, by making the shots down the rail not acceptable at speed, you have taken away a very important shot all great players have in their bag, we've 'removed' there force follow Shot/Driver, its not right for the game of 9-BALL.

This shot still works if you find the middle of the pocket right? Practice harder my friend...

On 2006-11-19 14:57 , TheSurgeon Wrote:

My point was, when the object ball is off the rail slightly and you make contact with enought speed to come three rails around with the cue ball, and back down table, it DOESN'T accept the ball when you hit the pocket middle. The table would NOT allow the shot, but its a shot that should be available in 9-BALL .

I find that hard to believe after speaking to people who were in Manila...

IslandDrive - please stop comparing pool to golf and accept that maybe you're not very good. You seem to be the only person who has an issue with this.

Hey IslandDrive

I would like to ask you if you have checked if the table you're playing on, is single or double shims (Facings) and also, which make and model of table that you're playing on because generally, every table manufacturer, has very slight differences in terms of exactly how their tables play and to my knowledge, the best tables around are still Diamond and Brunswick, now it is not mostly a case of the pocket width, it is mostly a case that you need to be able to tighten your game, to allow for the tougher table or simply if you regularly practice on bigger pockets, buy yourself some pocket reducers to practice with tighter pockets , but I must admit, that from the shot that you are describing, it is a shot that you should very rarely need to play because if you're rolling the snowball good, you would have better shape, than what you have described

it depends on many factors, e.g. old cloth, cheap ball sets, or simply not being accurate enough as the other guys have mentioned, but either way, practicing with tighter pockets is better, you will be a much better player for it, trust me

Also, if a tighter pocket was a problem, then why is it that in the Derby City Classic, (I think it was, but I could be wrong ) they happily use(d) 4" pockets and some other tournaments have used this same pocket size, which is very tight by any standards, but will always show the difference between the good and the really good players

Either way, I hope that you can find way to resolve the problem

Willie

Willie, he's talking about the tables used at the recent WPC, you know the same ones at the World Cup and World Masters and last years WPC.

The pockets were fine, I know I played on them and the shot he is talking about is definitely playable.

I never heard any complaints from any players over at Manila either.

Pat, I know he is talking about the tables at the WPC, etc, but I'm just saying why he may not make the shot, if it was in his local dog and biscuit and yes, I know only too well that the shot is playable

Willie

In defence of "Island Drive" I must say I DID see a few shots at the WPC similar to those described and they looked good, potted balls, hitting the inside facing of the corner pocket, but for one reason or another, didn't sink!

Did anyone else see these shots?

I only got to see 1 match Dave and that was Pat's last 16 match, when I was at Joe's house before I opened up at Club 9, that day, but I think that on a table with new cloth and tighter pockets, there's always that possibility that any slide there is with the new cloth and new balls, that the odd one or 2 will bobble in the jaws an hang up the phone on you, I think that it is a nasty thing about pool, that can only be looked at as something that happens, it might be down to the player hitting the shot badly, it might be just an evil twist of fate, that keeps the ball in the blue felt jungle , I thank that many or every player has had it happen at 1 time or another

Willie

On 2006-11-19 20:12 , BigDave Wrote:

Having watched/played/and won a pro event in 89 I consider myself one who understands the nature of this game, 9-BALL.

I have played it competitively since 1963. If you have played, competed, watched snooker for that many years it too has developed a taste and style that you have come to enjoy, know and EXPECT.

The current table conditions in world championship play do not allow the shooter to attack the table and play offensive pool the way 9-ball is meant.

When a ball cannot be run down the rail at high speed, hit the facing an go in you have taken the game out of 9-BALL, nine ball is great Offense and shot making.

You can have tight pockets that let balls enter at high speed down the rail or you can choose not too.

The sounds of a player splitting the pocket and drawing the cue or following the cue 3 or 4 rails is special and an integral part of this game.

When you see and feel a player doing this before your eyes in match play its and aspect of 9-BALL that should be protected and coveted, the table should not be allowed to change to sport of 9-BALL.

I see what you're saying IslandDrive and to quite an extent, I agree with what you're pointing out

As far as I understand it, you're saying that the tables nowadays seem to be too much more like a snooker table with the much tighter pockets, instead of being like a how pool table should be

I must admit, that I wouldn't be suprised if the tables were ordered with deeper shelving in the pockets, as well as being double faced, to suit the snooker players a little more, as well as the alternate breaks, which I thought was the biggest load of rubbish and the 8ball tournament (Alternate Breaks) format put me off bothering to make an effort to watch the event, hence the reason why I only saw 1 match.

In general, as I said before, you should be able to allow yourself to be in shape on the ball on, so that you don't have to play the 3 rail shape maker, but I agree with you, that 9Ball is indeed meant to be an attacking and shot making game, instead of all this slowing it down and tightening up rubbish.

I too wish that they would bring pool back to the way that it used to be and the way it should be, in terms of the nature of the game and how it was meant to be played, the way that guys like Efren, Jimmy Rempe, Earl Strickland and all of the legendary players, remember how it was meant to be played

I know that some of you think that I may have had a change of opinion on this, but in fact, I've had this view for quite some time now, I too have noticed that 9Ball is becoming a bit too much like snooker and I hate seeing that, especially since I grew up playing 9ball and playing it in an attacking way, the way that it is supposed to be played and so I'm at the point that I would rather see a snooker player being able to adapt to how 9ball should be played, instead of 9ball being adapted to how they play

There may be a few of you with will probably flame me left, right and centre for having this view, but I don't care because everyone has their own views and ideas, which I respect entirely, but I'm going to play 9ball the way it should be played and the way that I grew up playing it, the same as all the legendary players did

Willie

OK ISLANDDRIVE

confident players will play the game as it is as will the legends of the game

anyway every single rack does not require the shots that you maybe have a mental block over

my advice would be to learn to stroke through the ball more, you can send a ball 3rails just with side spin and little pace

also how can you comment on tables that you never played on?

Indiana is right on the 3 rail shape maker, just a hair of top and juice up the snowball the lefty smoke to swing it round off the sleepers and there, you're on the next dot

Willie (Looking at the confusion of everyone trying to work out what I just said lol)

Hello,
Here's some food for thought. What about Clive Everton's comments during the last IPT event that American pool is too easy and should have the pockets tightened even further? To me there is still skill in slopping a ball into a pocket provided you intentionally do that to achieve position that you couldn't otherwise get. That's part of what makes pool so exciting, attacking and different to snooker. Many of those with a snooker background never seem to grasp that though! They seem to want pool to be played on snooker spec equipment which would defeat the point. The Russian Pyramid players don't pick on snooker and tell the top players that they should play on tighter tables like they do do they!

My point is all the cue sports have their good points and the table specs play a huge role in this.

Chris.

I still stick with my original reply, the tables were 1st class.

There's nothing more annoying than a bad player MISSING a pot by TWO diamonds and huge bucket pockets swallowing it up.

If you want to shoot balls that easy go play in your local club, I agree with tournament organisers using the tighter pockets for Professional's to compete on as they should be able to shoot straight.

i agree pat!!!

Just out of curiousity and wanting to be sure about what ID is saying, what were the actually pocket measurments at the WPC?

I agree with you also Pat, to an extent as the scenario, that ID is talking about, can still be made, just a little less speed and more English to comensate , but it's like I said in my first post, if you're shooting accurately enough, then it's a scenario that you really shouldn't have to deal with if you're at the table because generally you wanna keep the cue ball in centre table so that it's easier to get to where you wanna go on the table

Willie

P.S. Paddy, I'll e-mail you a link for the straight pool rules, that you were asking for on the irish9ball.com site, I hope this will help out a little in some way or another

just sent u an email

email me back when u can