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Ben Clayton v Phil Burford |
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Barron147
Quite a regular
Joined: 01-Jun-2006
Posts: 48
From: Doncaster
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Posted: 2007-10-17 18:44
it was me dixon who enquired about the game with Phil, what ya reckon Phil, been wanting to get into this game properly and think that this would be motivation to do so, so how about
9 Ball
Winner Breaks
Race to 30
No Jump Cues
1k a Man
Cheers
Michael Barron
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Jump_Shot
Home away from home
Joined: 05-Jun-2007
Posts: 501
From: Yorkshire
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Posted: 2007-10-17 19:23
mmmm
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The_Mole
Home away from home
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 269
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Posted: 2007-10-17 21:14
9 Ball
Winner Breaks
Race to 30
No Jump Cues
Michael Barron
That was a good move you've just told your opposition that you can't jump 
That's the whole point of 9ball and I could not see Phil agreeing to that.
no jump cues!! do u want 2 shots carry aswell? 
The Mole ..... having a laugh----------------- www.themole.me
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striker
Home away from home
Joined: 27-Jul-2006
Posts: 431
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Posted: 2007-10-18 03:03
On 2007-10-17 21:14 , The_Mole Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!!
9 Ball
Winner Breaks
Race to 30
No Jump Cues
Michael Barron
That was a good move you've just told your opposition that you can't jump
That's the whole point of 9ball and I could not see Phil agreeing to that.
no jump cues!! do u want 2 shots carry aswell?
The Mole ..... having a laugh
didnt appleton and donlon play to those rules.whats wrong with no jump cues if your new to the game,makes sense really. back on topic spoke to ben and steve tonight and no chance of him playin phil till february so game is not going to happen,steve did tell me put though that ben would play riggers for 500 a man english 8 ball 500 a man american 9 ball 500 a man told me to post this so dont shoot the messenger riggers
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Jump_Shot
Home away from home
Joined: 05-Jun-2007
Posts: 501
From: Yorkshire
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Posted: 2007-10-18 07:30
money games flying round all over
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Ads
Home away from home
Joined: 07-Sep-2007
Posts: 1894
From: Essex, England
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Posted: 2007-10-18 08:20
didnt appleton and donlon play to those rules.whats wrong with no jump cues if your new to the game,makes sense really.
Because that takes away a big advantage that phil has. If your new to the game then you should get used to using the short stick coz if you dont your going to be at a dissadvantage. In my opinion jumps should mostly be allowed. I think that if both players cant jump then they wont, and if they both can they will, if one cant and the other can then thats an advantage the jumper has, Its just like the knowledge of the rails, if somebody doesnt know there angles, then they're going to have a dissadvantage.
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Riggers
Home away from home
Joined: 30-Mar-2006
Posts: 4454
From: Barnsley (centre of the universe)
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Posted: 2007-10-18 09:37
On 2007-10-18 03:03 , striker Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!! On 2007-10-17 21:14 , The_Mole Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!!
9 Ball
Winner Breaks
Race to 30
No Jump Cues
Michael Barron
That was a good move you've just told your opposition that you can't jump
That's the whole point of 9ball and I could not see Phil agreeing to that.
no jump cues!! do u want 2 shots carry aswell?
The Mole ..... having a laugh
didnt appleton and donlon play to those rules.whats wrong with no jump cues if your new to the game,makes sense really.
back on topic
spoke to ben and steve tonight and no chance of him playin phil till february so game is not going to happen,steve did tell me put though that ben would play riggers for 500 a man
english 8 ball 500 a man
american 9 ball 500 a man
told me to post this so dont shoot the messenger riggers And when does he want to play this? Next July? I think I'll offer a challenge to Dynamite, race to 30 for £10K a man, to be played in 2015. Then when it gets nearer the time if my game hasn't stepped up 6 gears I'll change my mind Of course I'll play Ben £500 race to 21 minimum each of those games any time he wants.
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expertfluke
Home away from home
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 749
From: Hertfordshire
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Posted: 2007-10-18 10:06
Riggers - your money match against Dynamite. I'm on holiday 2015 can you do it the year after?
Point is if you agree to a money match you should be ready within say 4-6 weeks.
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thediamond
Home away from home
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 1520
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Posted: 2007-10-18 10:19
Eric If Mr Barron wants a jump cue, tell him to come over for an afternoon and I will supply him with one and give him a few lessons on jumping. He needs to learn. Jumping is part of 9 ball until BCA or WPA say otherwise. [ This message was edited by: thediamond on 2007-10-18 10:22 ]
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DomOnThe9
Quite a regular
Joined: 27-Aug-2006
Posts: 67
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Posted: 2007-10-18 10:21
On 2007-10-18 10:19 , thediamond Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!! Eric
If Mr Baron wants a jump cue, tell him to come over for an afternoon and I will supply him with one and give him a few lessons on jumping. He needs to learn.
Jumping is part of 9 ball until BCA or WPA say otherwise. Agree ----------------- 
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Ads
Home away from home
Joined: 07-Sep-2007
Posts: 1894
From: Essex, England
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Posted: 2007-10-18 11:06
thanks for supporting my post diamond, sometimes 1 jump shot determins the whole match
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PC
Official Pro9 Tipster!
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 780
From: Leeds
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Posted: 2007-10-18 11:36
I agree jumping is part of the game, but with the current technology its surely far too easy, i think it should be a minimum of a full cue jump now, or ban any tip that is not 100% leather based. If any of you have tried to jump with a BK2 its surprisingly easy, and i'm sure with practice it would still be a good tool, but it would stop the silly 1 inch from ball jumps after a player has made a good safe. Before the jump cues players used to use just a shaft to jump but this became so easy that they changed it, and now there is a minimum cue length introduced. This change was made before the "new" generation of tips though and i think that the BCA/WPA need to look at the changes to the technology and adapt the rules to increase the skill level. I much more enjoy seeing Efren or Deuel when hooked work out how to kick at the ball not just how to hit it but where the balls are going to go, either for an attacking shot or a kick safe. Before people jump on me at the moment i don't carry a jump cue just a playing cue and a BK2, but when my new cues arrive i will be carrying a jump butt as for the time being it is part of the game and as such i can agree with what people say that until its not then you have to just play to the current rules. Although thediamond would probably be able to say he cant remember the last time i reached for a jump stick lol. -----------------  [ This message was edited by: PC on 2007-10-18 11:38 ]
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The_Mole
Home away from home
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 269
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Posted: 2007-10-18 12:00
I'm with PC on this one - you play what the rules say no matter what your private thoughts are We all love and hate jump cues and jump shots and this subject will go round and round as long as the jump shot is allowed.
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nicknameless
Home away from home
Joined: 10-Jan-2007
Posts: 560
From: Birmingham
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Posted: 2007-10-18 12:14
If I was playing someone relatively new to American tables I'd be more than happy to agree to no jump cues as you are likely to have a large advantage in terms of kicking (unless you normally get the jump cue out every time you don't have a clear path to the object ball). Any monkey can use a jump cue. [ This message was edited by: nicknameless on 2007-10-18 12:15 ]
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Riggers
Home away from home
Joined: 30-Mar-2006
Posts: 4454
From: Barnsley (centre of the universe)
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Posted: 2007-10-18 12:28
On 2007-10-18 11:36 , PC Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!! I agree jumping is part of the game, but with the current technology its surely far too easy, .... Mr Barron obviously doesn't think so However, I do agree with the comments about kicking, and I have to admit it makes for a better game when jumpshots are not allowed IMO. I say this from first hand experience having just practised with Daz sometimes for 5 hours a night for weeks prior to his match with Tommy where no jump shots were allowed. I learned so much about kicking you just wouldn't believe and am a much better player for it IMO. Sure there are a few shots where I would still reach for the jump cue if it were allowed but now they are well and truly in the minority whereas before I would have reached for it more often than not when hooked. Anyone who plays a lot and uses a jump cue a lot I'd recommend taking it out of the case for a few months and see how much you can learn. [ This message was edited by: Riggers on 2007-10-18 12:30 ]
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thediamond
Home away from home
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 1520
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Posted: 2007-10-18 12:32
Sorry Jonathan but rules are rules. Its a part of the game. I feel if you can't jump then learn quick and don't start banding money matches about the place when you you can't play a full game. Tommy and Daz have not set a precedent, it was just one of those things they both agreed to. I am sure if Phil is happy with no jump cues then no problem, I just don't think he should be asked to relinquish a skill he has developed over the years to his advantage on the basis a newcomer can't (or wont) jump a ball.
Making up rules to suit is a total crock.
Efren has a jump cue.....nuff said.
PS...well done on winning APN.....top going, I don't think I said that on your thread
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nicknameless
Home away from home
Joined: 10-Jan-2007
Posts: 560
From: Birmingham
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Posted: 2007-10-18 12:53
On 2007-10-18 12:32 , thediamond Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!! Sorry Jonathan but rules are rules. Its a part of the game. I feel if you can't jump then learn quick and don't start banding money matches about the place when you you can't play a full game. Tommy and Daz have not set a precedent, it was just one of those things they both agreed to. I am sure if Phil is happy with no jump cues then no problem, I just don't think he should be asked to relinquish a skill he has developed over the years to his advantage on the basis a newcomer can't (or wont) jump a ball.
Making up rules to suit is a total crock.
Efren has a jump cue.....nuff said.
PS...well done on winning APN.....top going, I don't think I said that on your thread Agree rules are rules. But a simple question. Who has the bigger advantage against a newcomer to american tables? (1) a seasoned american pool player who can kick effectively in a no jump shots allowed game or (2) the same player who can jump effectively where they are allowed. In scenario (2) the non-american pool player can learn to make simple jump escapes in a minimal amount of time which would negate most of the advantage of the seasoned player. The same cannot be said of the kicking game and the nuances of jumping don't give anywhere near the advantage that a good kicker would have in situation (1) above. It doesn't take years to become an effective jumper (I think you could give any half decent cueist a jump cue and have them jumping and hitting balls well within an hour). Not so for the multitude of kicking situations. Rules aside I'd take the offer of no jump cues allowed (unless I feared my opponents safety game that is!).
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thediamond
Home away from home
Joined: 13-Mar-2006
Posts: 1520
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Posted: 2007-10-18 13:06
....but I see top players miss jump shots all the time. Its not all about the jump....it includes pot (or safety) and position. That isn't picked up asap. A skill is a skill, people need to learn jumping if they want to play under current rules. I feel I can keep up with anyone in the UK for jumping balls, something I am very proud of.
Again, if Phil is happy with the arrangement, then no problem. He shouldn't be backed into a corner just to take the match thats all. I am 100% sure he would take the match with full rules. Take out one element and it changes the bet....good or bad.
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PC
Official Pro9 Tipster!
Joined: 14-Mar-2006
Posts: 780
From: Leeds
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Posted: 2007-10-18 13:22
On 2007-10-18 12:32 , thediamond Wrote:!!! QUOTE !!!
Efren has a jump cue.....nuff said.
But have you ever seen him jump?? I been listening to the commentators on all those accu-stats dvd's talk about this and they have never seen him??? I think we need to employ Daz on this one to speak to Efren when he is over there to find out??? Daz are you able to help out? -----------------
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striker
Home away from home
Joined: 27-Jul-2006
Posts: 431
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Posted: 2007-10-18 13:25
so its ok for daz and tommy to make there own rules up but no one else,take your tongues out,for christs sake.
if barron and phil agree to that what has it to do with anyone else,thats all im saying,not havin a dig or owt..
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